Prosecutor Amijo started her cross examination by reminding Rick he had indicated to counsel he was never told his products would be used to shoot people.  Rick agreed.

She stated statements were made on video where he specifically referred to shooting [people].  Rick answered there is a difference between defending yourself and shooting people.

Armijo referred him to the undercover operation of 07/29/2011 to a part where Rick stated that he hoped his guns went to Mexico, and he hoped they used them to shoot those M—F—s in the a—–l.   It then sounded like Rick stated “….. federales to shoot those people.”  Armjijo asked him if federales are people, and Rick answered yes.

Ms. Armijo persisted and asked again if on video he stated he hoped his products would be used to shoot people.  I did not hear Rick answer.

She continued and asked if the transcripts were an accurate representation, and Rick answered he saw it on video and yes.

Armijo then switched to the recent FFL license and the prior 28 yr FFL license.  Rick replied to a question that he had a LLC some years before, and ATF wanted him to change the license to reflect his name to conform [to regulations].  He stated he was allowed to continue to stay open until the papers were changed and that it was the first time after a decade they came up with this.  He admitted Vaughn Smith was the inspector involved in this.

Rick agreed that he used the change-over period to do a going-out-of-business sale as a business promotion, and was assured he was allowed to operate.

When he was asked if in a conference with ATF that the inspector recommended revoking his license, but gave him a warning instead, Rick hesitated.

Armijo retrieved an exhibit and stated they didn’t take away his license.  Rick stated correct, not revoked.  He agreed with her it was a warning conference and that  inspector Smith was there and that they went over all the compliance issues.

He agreed he had received a letter from ATF that talked about violation, and that yes the letter was found on the property.

He was shown another exhibit, another letter found on the property from the ATF supervisor (Arnold) referring to the August 2009 conference that they were not going to revoke his license, went over some things including the name of sole individual responsible for management of New Deal.  Rick stated that was not correct, that he sent a letter to Arnold to not place his wife & son’s name on the license.  He didn’t want their names in harms way, he only wanted his name on the license.

Armijo moved on to another exhibit a letter from Arnold detailing the warning conference, which included an out of state drivers license, the incidents with the military temporary & permanent address orders, and three other violations.  And the review is to explain why violations and important to reduce crime and protect the public.  Rick answered yes, that was what was written.  He didn’t recall exactly but was involved.

Armijo pointed out the section that future violations may result in his license being revokes, to which he responded he saw that.

Armijo reviewed the fine print and went over the purpose of the review and he signed it.  Rick stated yes, and that the form has changed many times.  She continued to go over small details on the form and at one point Rick stated they wouldn’t bring up every thing if there wasn’t a problem and they usually focused on store problems.  He agreed they would go over everything and then focus on problems.

Armijo stated when Vaughn Smith discussed straw purchasers, Rick didn’t recall and stated it has been 3 years.

Armijo asked him if he was stating he didn’t know what a straw purchaser is?” and Rick replied no, he didn’t say that.  A straw purchaser comes in with the intent to deceive the FFL, and he agreed it is a way to purchase for someone else.

Armijo showed him a piece of paper, and Rick stated he wasn’t familiar with it, but he has heard of Project Gunrunner but hadn’t seen that brochure.

When asked if he was familiar with ATF’s effort in the last 5 years to combat straw purchasing, he said yes he always had that attitude.  He agreed ATF wanted them to be on the lookout for straw purchasers.  The went over a couple of examples.

When asked if inspections are unannouced, Rick agreed stating they just show up.

When asked if the first thing they do is look at inventory, Rick agreed; and when ask if he assisted them, he replied absolutely.

She asked Rick if he knew the area under the store, and he identified it as the storage area, the vault, the hole, but not a bunker.  He agreed he store weapons there.  He also stated there would be inventory outside the store, as they would go to gun shows and at times had inventory in the locked travel trailer.

When asked if he recalled during the 2008 inspection that the agents car broke down, Rick stated it has been a long time and he doesn’t remember everything.

She asked if that gave him time to pull everything out of storage.  He said possible but he didn’t recall.

Armijo showed him a paper dated 08/27/08 and Rick stated it refreshed his memory.  Armijo pointed out that he had written he was thanking the Lord their car broke down.  Rick answered he thanks the Lord a lot, and told her it takes a while to get inventory up from storage to they could count everything.  He stated he was thanking the Lord because it would give them enough time to pull the inventory upstairs.

When asked if they went over the forms again, Rick replied the business didn’t stop, and there were times when he had to help customers at the same time.  He also stated he can’t bring up extra inventory during regular business hours when customers are in the store.

Armeji continued questioning Rick (part 6)